White Lies | עמוד דיון
תקציר
White Lies
What should I do when my friend is dating a monster?
סיכום ביניים
Seinfeld's dilemma of truth versus compassion was compared to a Talmudic debate about how to complement an ugly bride. While both values are considered very important in the Jewish tradition , Beit Hilllel claimed that you cannot offend someone for the sake of sticking to the truth. An interesting rebuttal was made that this will lead to a phony polite society where you can never know what others are thinking of you (as illustrated in the Seinfeld ugly baby episode).
הדיון המורחב
In terms of the ugly baby episode, I think this is a situation where you must lie. A baby is a sensitive issue enough where not a singke parent wants to think that their child is ugly. The emotions and love attached to the baby are so strong that if any friend tells the parents it is ugly is a huge insult. Even if the parents recognize the fact that the baby is ugly, they find the cute aspects of the child and that is all that they want to see.
תגובות אחרונות
talia says:
I think that with the ugly baby scenario, it would be pointless to tell the parents that their baby is ugly. Not only would it hurt their feelings, but it would not change the looks of the baby. It would make the parents happy if you told them a white lie, it would keep the peace. As in the story with Avraham, if even God is lying to keep the peace surely we should too.
I think that with the ugly baby scenario, it would be pointless to tell the parents that their baby is ugly. Not only would it hurt their feelings, but it would not change the looks of the baby. It would make the parents happy if you told them a white lie, it would keep the peace. As in the story with Avraham, if even God is lying to keep the peace surely we should too.
I agree, Alex. By not commenting on the baby's physique, you are distancing yourself from lying; I would even conclude that you're not lying at all considering the fact that you're avoiding the subject altogether. Since this is not a life or death situation – like that of Avram's – and since the parent's do not have a choice in how their baby looks nor can do anything about it, it is preferable to distance yourself from telling a lie.
I didn’t say that you should comment on other qualities of the baby. I simply said that according to the opinion of Beit Shammai, it’s probably best to avoid speaking about the baby’s appearance.
But can you even comment on other qualities of the baby when you do not know the personality of the baby?
In telling the parents that their baby is ugly, you are only inflicting harm. Because there is neither a solution nor a way to improve their problem, there is no reason to give your negative opinion. While you do not necessarily have to lie about their baby being good looking – as that would be an intentional lie – you also shouldn't inflict pointless pain.
What does it mean to be ugly? Are we only talking about physical attractiveness?
While I agree with most of what you said, I don't think that in this scenario you have to lie. Perhaps you can just entirely avoid any commenting regarding the baby's appearance.
Couldn't you also use this logic over the question of whether to tell your friend their partner is a monster? A partner in a relationship also has emotion attached, potentially strong emotions, and if your friend hears that that you think their partner is a monster, they could be very insulted. Do you then also think that you should lie when you think your friend's partner is a monster?
Max Sosland
Couldn't you also use this logic over the question of whether to tell your friend their partner is a monster? A partner in a relationship also has emotion attached, potentially strong emotions, and if your friend hears that that you think their partner is a monster, they could be very insulted. Do you then also think that you should lie when you think your friend's partner is a monste
אלכס רויזמן
While I agree with most of what you said, I don't think that in this scenario you have to lie. Perhaps you can just entirely avoid any commenting regarding the baby's appearance.
Joshua Silverman
What does it mean to be ugly? Are we only talking about physical attractiveness?
But isn't also a good idea to avoid talking about the baby's looks after all? According to Beit Shamai in the text, you should avoid talking about the baby's look period. There are so many things one can talk about when seeing the baby, like talking about the name, the cute little feet, etc.
Ari Spellman
talking about the baby’s looks at all?
According to Beit Shamai in the text,
you should avoid talking about the baby’s look period.
There are so many things one can talk about when seeing the baby,
like talking about the name, the cute little feet, etc.